[clark]

WOW! well i see i've kicked up quite a storm here  I personally am giulty of using foam indicators but i only have used enough foam to carry the flies and no more. I remember a fishing session with hamish when the fish were hammering bloodworms on haddo and it was much more enjoyable when using a dry fly because you could see the fish coming up to take a sniff at the dry and it was really thrilling 

clark

[Graeme Gauld]

I assure you that we are all seriously considering stopping "Bung/indicator" fishing on our waters altogether
Mike i have to say that if it happens it wont come quick enough for me
myself and the fishing club i am a member of apply our own rules ie No bung/indicators, boobies allowed at any of our outings
, boobies for the damage they can cause toe the fish
bung/indicators because that is not fly fishing.

[Rob Brownfield]

I started to use indicators when nymphing on the river, purely because I was fishing "ruffled" water and could not see the line in the gloom.

I tried it twice on stillwaters...and it was devistatingly effective...so went back to my normal cast and hope

But..I have a few questions about the method. (stillwater only)

Is it effective because of the way the flies fish, ie, at 3 depths, held in place by the "bung" ?

or

Is it effective because more "takes" are seen and therefore it seems the method is more effective?

Also, as its impossible for a fish to take a fly without the bung moving, bobbing or going under, does it not mean that it is less likely that a fish will take a fly deep. Without the bung a fish can move some distance before the fly line would move, especially if its moving towards you.

[Barry Robertson]

I also agree that bungs should be banned and people should learn to fish with a floater and see takes for themselves!
Its becoming more like coarse fishing every day, now those thingymabobers are selling like hot cakes and thats practically bubble float fishing.
Dont get me wrong i think they work well as the fly is static at a certain depth and fish seem to love that


Anyway whos is doing an APPS step by step 

[Robert MacDonald-Lewis]

Personally I do not like using an indicator, for me it’s just not what fly fishing is about.  I hasten to add that this is purely my opinion and I do not think any lees of those who use this technique, each to his own.

I can see the attraction in the technique as it appears to be the ideal way of presenting buzzers at specific depths.  Of course this can also be achieved by using a suitable dry fly.  Mikes’ comment that people using a dry fly instead of an indicator tend not fish as aggressively was very interesting as there would seem to be little difference between the two techniques.

At the risk of opening a can of worms I would suggest that the problem may not be the technique but the person on the other end of the line.  If the use of indicators was band would the people who had been using indicator not just start fishing with a buoyant fly instead?

[Rob Brownfield]

Its becoming more like coarse fishing every day,

Ahem..lol.I beg your pardon  

I would never consider using 2-4 hooks, casting out and waiting for a stockie to hang itself on heavy gear

Have to agree with those Thingymabobers..I pass a fishery every day and I can see them from the roadside from 60-80 yards away!!! Not very subtle at all!

[Rob Brownfield]

At the risk of opening a can of worms I would suggest that the problem may not be the technique but the person on the other end of the line.  If the use of indicators was band would the people who had been using indicator not just start fishing with a buoyant fly instead?

I would agree with that statement entirely. I watched two people on a boat fishing boobies. One held the rod, kept in touch with the flies and struck when he felt a take..the other chap cast out, laid the rod across the boat and sat and waited until the tip pulled round.

To me, one was fly fishing, the other was effectively ledgering (quivertipping).

[Robert MacDonald-Lewis]

Jimminy,

Any pattern using more than one bead (two small small beads tied perpendracula to the hook shank is accepted  ) is a crass abuse of our devolved rights to tie flies.

Any fish feasting on something from Beaverbrooks window deserves to get eaten!

Iain

Could this be the exception that proves the rule? http://www.czechnymphs.com/tactics/tactics_2003_010.html, 

[ryan]

hi i am new to using this forum i would like to say i have been reading comments on here for a while and would like to say got some helpfull tips from you guys in winter the fly that has been most succsesfull for me is the orange zonker fished near the bottom caught many fish with that found that with a slow retreive the fish give a good bang and then rip line from you also green and black lures at any depth at where i usually fish the loch of logie tried the bloodworm a few times dont think i am fishing them correctly can anyone give me tips on depth and speed of retreive to fish them i would recomend the orange zonker to anyone been succsesfull at haddo and very succsesfull at lochter for me


ps hopeing to fish haddo this weekend or next hope tosee some of you guys there

[Iain Goolager]

Could this be the exception that proves the rule?

Roberto, fair spy BUT the industry has seen the error if its' ways  and designed the Bidoz Body (single weighted system with the desired undershape) so I'm sticking to my moral high ground

By the way, it's the multi plastic type beads that brings the bile 


Here's a quote by John Tyzak after using the fly....
" Although I'm delighted to catch such a specimen I want to apologise to the fishing brotherhood for the use of such a multi beaded fly"  as read in the Dressmakers Monthly July 2003 edition.

It's true   

Iain

[Rob Brownfield]

So you wont like these then Iain







 

Not mine I hasten to add although the shrimpy ones look interesting

[ryan]

i have used flys simaler to the ones rob has shown on loch of logie worked well i will use any fly that seems to work i think trying new flys and designs is part of fly fishing and it can is really satisfying when you try something new that works although i like to use tradititional flys sometimes you get angry and frustrated after day fishing and you get nothing if it means fishing a beaded fly then why not as long as it legal in that fishery where is the harm being done i will take advantage of any fly that can pull my line tight and put a smile on my face 

[clark]

Hi ryan, I will be at haddo on sunday so if you come along i will quite happily show you how to fish this pattern because it is usually my go to fly at this time of year  just look out for the 6'4 16 year old with hippy hair     

clark

[Mike Barrio]

Hi folks

I am always a tad wary of posting in threads like this, as it is obviously easy for me to become the "bad guy fishery owner come purist"

I know of one local fishery that bans indicators in competitions and another that only allows their use with bonafide buzzers. I also know of a couple of local clubs that don't allow them in their competitions. So I am confident that I am not the only person with concerns regarding their use and of course, I do not currently have any rules against them at Haddo.

For the moment I will do my very best to keep an open mind and allow folk to enjoy their sport as they wish, but, if I see as many folk using them with lures and blobs etc as I did last winter ...... I will ban them altogether as I can't see any alternative way forward.

My main concerns obviously being aggressive striking and flies being left in the fish when the leader breaks. Aggressive, bad casting is another issue, anglers desperately trying to cast with heavy lines to carry the indicator, which disturbs the water and puts the fish down. I remember very clearly a cracking morning at the loch one day this year where everybody was enjoying great sport with dries, spiders and nymphs and 4 anglers came along and started fishing just after midday with indicators in this manner, within about 15 to 20 minutes nobody was catching fish on the whole loch and I can remember feeling quite embarrassed that I had let these anglers on the water and spoilt everybody else's sport

Best wishes
Mike

[Robert MacDonald-Lewis]

Iain, Touché!  We could always do away with weighting flies and put lead shot on the leader instead , oops I think I just went too far 

[Iain Goolager]

Hi Rob or should I say Satan!
The shrimps look interesting from the side but like squashed jelly babies or fruit gums from above

The second picture is what I'm talking about Lazy,Lazy,Lazy, ugly ugly, horrid things.

Third picture - result of Tyers Block at the vise day?

you really are a one

Callum get your hair cut!

Iain

[Robert MacDonald-Lewis]

Mike, I am not familiar with how people fish lures and blobs in conjunction with Indicators.  Are they fished static?

[Iain Goolager]

lead shot on the leader instead , oops I think I just went too far

 

or a wye lead perhaps for those difficult to get to lies

[Mike Barrio]

Mike, I am not familiar with how people fish lures and blobs in conjunction with Indicators.  Are they fished static?

Yes, mostly static Robbie and sometimes with a very slow buzzer like retrieve.

Best wishes
Mike

[Ben Dixon]

or a wye lead perhaps for those difficult to get to lies

I am quite happy to admit to using tungsten and non toxic shot on the leader to get small nymphs down deep in fast water or deep pools when required, don't like doing it but sometimes it is required.  Used a lot on the US on rivers.

Cheers

Ben

[Iain Goolager]

You'll need some on the Soca? Slovenia next year.

Here's what I like to drop off a Klink on running water



Iain

[Mike Barrio]

I like the look of that nymph Iain ........ excellent stuff

You know what I'm gonna say: "step.............."

Cheers
Mike

[ryan]

sometimes when i need to get down quickly i use nylon i got for sea fishing it tends to go down quicker than most fly leaders it usually a wee bit thicker than normal leader someone once gave me it to replace the line on my sea rod bought and used it many times since its also cheaper as its usually a longer spool you get for your money cant remember the name of the stuff but you get it in dicks sports in fraserburgh hope to see you on sunday clark look for the five foot ten lad with a green suit and red hat with a six foot two mate with a stupid grin on his face and grey hair  

[Iain Goolager]

Hi Ryan,

five foot ten lad with a green suit and red hat with a six foot two mate with a stupid grin on his face and grey hair

is Maid Marion going too?

Only jokin' hope you have a good days fishin'

Iain

[Barry Robertson]

Hi Mike,
What in your opinion constitutes an indicator or bung and is Haddo totally "foam free" or is it just boobies that are banned?  Not trying to be  controversial here but I am fairly sure I could tie a Klink or G & H sedge big enough to support a gold head blob, a Klink with a large yellow & pink post would be as visible as a fish pimp or thingamabollocks indicator.  Is it the method that is the issue for you or the "hardware" usually used by those fishing the method, eg foam flies?  I would ban blue or red hooks but there again, I am bitter & twisted 

Baz, PM me your adress and I will send you something on condition that you give them a review and we get some pics.

Cheers

Ben

Pm sent Ben 
Better not be posting me thingymabobers, if you are make sure they are monster sized ones