[Derek Roxborough]

some thing like 30,000 escapees this year,Lewis site killing fish to prevent spread of disease, what next? surely it's about time there was a review  of the industry, ? Derek Roxborough

[Hamish Young]

In the age of 'renewable' energy, and thus potentially cheap power, it's high time this industry and blight on our seascape and the marine environment was moved to land based pump ashore tank systems. The technology has been there for 30+ years, but the political will power and the incentives to make it happen are sorely lacking.

[Travis Jones]

In the age of 'renewable' energy, and thus potentially cheap power, it's high time this industry and blight on our seascape and the marine environment was moved to land based pump ashore tank systems. The technology has been there for 30+ years, but the political will power and the incentives to make it happen are sorely lacking.

I agree with this. It's such a shame, real shame, that politics would always get in the way of progress.

[Derek Roxborough]

you may notice that the Protection of wild salmon doesn't enter in to it these days, this was the original cry over  40 yrs back  ??? Derek Roxborough

[Bob Mitchell]

To many votes from persons that eat the stuff and not enough salmon fishers to worry about.
A friend who has just sold after three years is B. & B. in Orkney  tells me that the sea bed beside the cages is covered in a deep layer of grey sludge.   S.E.P.A. seam to be content to be pushed around by the government rather than make a stand.
When I look at the number of goosanders in my bit of river and that the grayling and the browns have almost been wiped out it just leaves the parr to feed on.   Wonder there is any salmon left to spawn.
Our generation seams to have made an awful mess of the planet ?
Bob.

[Derek Roxborough]

think about this, when there was coastal fishing there was still a head of salmon reaching the rivers, the coastal nets were bought out where are the extra salmon that should be returning ? it requires a government initiative, and that we don't have,  Derek Roxborough

[Rob Brownfield]

To many votes from persons that eat the stuff and not enough salmon fishers to worry about.
A friend who has just sold after three years is B. & B. in Orkney  tells me that the sea bed beside the cages is covered in a deep layer of grey sludge.   S.E.P.A. seam to be content to be pushed around by the government rather than make a stand.
When I look at the number of goosanders in my bit of river and that the grayling and the browns have almost been wiped out it just leaves the parr to feed on.   Wonder there is any salmon left to spawn.
Our generation seams to have made an awful mess of the planet ?
Bob.

SEPA seem to bend and sway with the wind. Not sure if this has progressed any further, but the worlds biggest fish farm was being considered off of Orkney.
http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/15071210.Outrage_over_secret_plans_to_base_world__39_s_biggest_salmon_farm_in_Scotland/

Then we have the issue of toxins, both in the feed, the flesh of the salmon and the marine life around cages
https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2017/apr/01/is-farming-salmon-bad-for-the-environment
https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2001/jan/07/fishing.food

[Bob Mitchell]

Thanks for the information in the links.
I remember  when there was no farmed salmon and the wild was poached to near extinction. We looked on farmed salmon as the saviour of the wild fish. We were ignorant of the future problems. I can not see how we can farm fish in enclosed tanks [much as I would like] and advertise them as wild Scotch salmon. Should this happen [enclosed tanks ] then the tanks would be placed nearest there markets. To me it would seam better to move cages out into strong currents under the surface and feed with a food which others can eat.
Keep thinking of the cages in likes of the Lake of Menteith were big rainbows are often caught feeding on the left over food.
What ever happens we must not lose the farmed salmon as the wild would be gone in next to no time.
Bob.

[Rob Brownfield]

What ever happens we must not lose the farmed salmon as the wild would be gone in next to no time.

I would respectively suggest that evidence points to the opposite conclusion.  As Salmon farms have increased in Western Scotland and Ireland (and Norway), catches of wild salmon and seatrout have dropped.

Both the Awe and Ewe systems have shown a significant drop this year (not only in catches, but numbers counted by counters) and Loch Maree is all but finished as a fishery.

The East coast rivers have remained pretty steady as a whole, with a slight increase for some.

Of course, there will be many factors that contribute, but having large "factories" spewing out "pollution" at the entrance to rivers can only be a bad thing.

Should also mention the decline in shellfish and Wrasse near cages too.

[Derek Roxborough]

I have lived here on the west coast  since 1969 I remember the coastal nets and catches of 2,000+ fish on Loch Maree  each season, even the local poachers didn't have the instant impact that salmon farming had, Marine Harvest set up in Loch Ewe  in 1985, over the next 3 years the loch Maree catches dropped to below 500 / season, the biggest  impact on fishing since the Ice age, it is my opinion that even if the salmon farms stopped now there would be little or no recovery for many years, so far from being a solution to the salmon survival the farms are the major problem, with  no signs  of going away Derek Roxborough

[Bob Mitchell]

Agreed that the salmon farms have caused most if not all the problems and now the shortage of fish. The east coast river that I fish is only a shadow of what it was.
The point I was trying to make is that if salmon farming stopped now what is left of the wild ones would be poached to death. Cymag/ walkerburn  angels/nets etc. for example. Watched the Endrick going down after a spate and pools were jammed full of fish. Next day empty with scales and other signs of nets being pulled up the bank.
Can not see the fish coming back soon as there are to many predators from seals to goosanders that would need to lose a lot of there numbers plus problems at sea.
Bob.

[Hamish Young]

Take your point about poaching - but the answer has always been to move the industry from where it does most harm into a contained environment in pump-to-shore tanks where it will have minimal impact.  Within a tank environment you can' get away with less' than you can in the freedom of a cage system.
So in other words we should keep Salmon farming, but in a different way to the way it is managed at the moment.  For the sake of the West coast fisheries - like Maree, Eilt, Shiel etc - it's never too late to bring Sea Trout back. By and large the money follows Salmon fishing,  we get so hung up on the plight of the Salmon that many tend to forget that one of our most iconic species the Sea Trout is on the verge of extinction in many places.
Cleaning up our on coastal waters where Sea Trout should be thriving is manageable. Attending to the broader issues of the feeding grounds where our Salmon go - not so manageable.

[Rob Brownfield]

I still believe keeping salmon farms, no matter if caged or enclosed, is not as "sustainable and healthy" as we are led to believe.

Whilst the content of salmon feed has seen a reduction from around 70% fish meal to about 35%, thus reducing the ridiculous situation of needing up to 8kg of wild caught fish to produce 1kg of farmed fish, they are now bulking feed with terrestrial based plants and oil.

That brings its own issues of fertilisers, deforestation for palm and canola oil (fish oil substitute for pellets) and production of crops not directly for human consumption.

This also introduces non marine based proteins and toxins into the marine food chain in the way of waste and uneaten pellets.

We have severe environmental issues in Chile, Tasmania, Norway, Russia, Ireland and Scotland associated with salmon farming. Is it not about time this industry was called into account rather than having millions thrown at it by governments?

[James Laraway]

I dont want to get political but salmon fishing is largely seen/ percieved by many as a 'toffs' / rich mans sport. As such the encumbant SG wont give a monkeys even if wild salmon are totally wiped out

[James Craig]

I noted with interest the following picture from the recent publication of the SG's "Scottish Land Rights & Responsibilities" white paper:



Looks like we'd live in a 'fairer', 'more productive' and 'more successful' Scotland if we adopted the fixed-line, dead-bait fishing with beach-casters principle on our lochs and rivers.

That might solve things, no?

[Bob Mitchell]

Mention of Loch Eilt brings back happy memory's of sitting in a boat dapping and the sea trout coming out of nowhere head and tailing for the fly. My friend had a cottage on the banks of the river out of the loch which looked like straight out of Brigadoon.
Bob.

[Derek Roxborough]

remember Nature abhors a vacuum, if you remove a species, then something will replace it,this was found out on the Grand banks when the cod were gone , another species replaced them , it was Lobsters, the cod there had been keeping the lobsters in check, once they were gone the lobsters thrived, I'm not suggesting there will be lobsters, but probably brown trout will move in to fill the niche, unless there is an expensive restocking program, you can't win  Derek Roxborough

[Hamish Young]

In fairness those West coast lochs I knew as a youngster for their Sea Trout have become - on the whole - pretty good Brown Trout waters which isn't all that surprising I suppose.
Must go back next season and explore some more.